[assassingod]

Brad check out my post, come stay with me

[Brad]

Originally Posted by Boofo

It's not that wqe are losing soldiers, it's guys with the attitude that they don't want to server their country that aren't signing up. If more people would want to server their country, they wouldn't have to have a draft.

Boofo I hate to pick on ya man but your post caught my attention. I don't know the hard facts but i'm willing to bet the US army is the largest in the world behind china. And in my honest opioion there is NO reason to have a draft in this day and age. We are not in any major conflict that our current reserves can't handle.

I don't know about you man but I love my for-fathers as much as anyone else, and im grateful to live in this country (altho some days I wish I was in a'dam). But im not going oversee's or anywhere else to fight any war I don't agree with.

[Reeve of shinra]

Boofo:

I personally would not want to be drafted. I disagree with the reasons we've stated for the invasion of Iraq and I do not feel confident that the administration is handling the war in the best possible way. Its not the training of the 'weekend warriors' that has dragged the war in Iraq out but rather poor "post war" planning. US Generals have gone on record saying that disposing of Saddam would be the easy part but rebuilding a democratic Iraq would be a very difficult task -- something our leader and chief ignored or failed to plan for appropriately.

Does this make me unpatriotic? I don't think so... I firmly believe in the constition and the principles America was founded on - priciples that are being abused more and more by our own government with every passing day. This is America though and in America, you can't question Bush because in doing so your helping terrorism.

"The situation in Iraq and the reckless economic policies in the United States speak to one issue for me, and that is the competence of our leader," Pelosi said. "These policies are not working. But speaking specifically to Iraq, we have a situation where -- without adequate evidence -- we put our young people in harm's way."

Asked specifically if she was calling Bush incompetent, Pelosi replied:

"I believe that the president's leadership in the actions taken in Iraq demonstrate an incompetence in terms of knowledge, judgment and experience in making the decisions that would have been necessary to truly accomplish the mission without the deaths to our troops and the cost to our taxpayers."

Pelosi charged the Bush administration has proved itself wrong on a number of issues with Iraq, including its initial assertions that Iraqis would welcome U.S. troops and that Iraq itself could pay for much of the reconstruction effort.

"Rocket-propelled grenades, not rose petals, greeted them," Pelosi said of U.S. troops. "Instead ... of Iraq being a country that would readily pay for its own reconstruction ... we're up to over $200 billion in cost to the American people."

Response from Tom DeLay - house leader:

"Nancy Pelosi should apologize for her irresponsible, dangerous rhetoric," DeLay, R-Texas, said. "She apparently is so caught up in partisan hatred for President Bush that her words are putting American lives at risk."

[Boofo]

Originally Posted by Dean C

Bob that is an attitude i'd have to disagree with completely. (Not that I live in the US but) Some of us have families, loved ones we care about. I'd rather not risk my life, and risk traumatising those that love me most. So that makes me a coward?

Do you think we didn't have loved ones back here that we cared about, too? But in order for us to maintain our quality of life here in the US. someone has to make the sacrifices. To insure my family doesn't have to suffer the pains of war, I will do my part as I have always done. Serve my country. And the only ones I was calling cowards are draft dodgers, if you will re-read the message you will see that. And, yes, Dean, if you were to dodge the draft, I would consider you to be a coward. Nothing personal to you, but I've been there and done my part and you or anyone else who takes for granted the freedoms they have are no better than I am and should do your part, too, for your family and loved ones if not for yourself.

[Scrub]

I would most deffinatly join the militray if needed, but due to some birth defects I can't.

[AWS]

I would have gone to Iraq myself if they would have let me.

You might say that now, but if you ever experienced armed battle you would think twice about saying it or about going to battle.
I was drafted in the last draft the US had in 1972. I was watching the news and they listed the top 100 birthdays. If your birthday was one of them you were called to duty. My birthday was the 5TH selected. I got my induction letter about a week later and chose to enlist in the Marines instead the Army.
Call me a draft dodger if you wish, but, knowing what I know now and what I experienced if I had to do it over I would have went to Canada.
I don't regret the service I did for my country, but, I would never do it again unless the battle was on our home soil.

[ap0c]

Originally Posted by Velocd

The Republican government is hoping for it in June 2005.

It seems they're pushing legislation silently until the election of 2004 is confirmed, so that it doesn't hurt Bush's chances.

.

Kerry and most democrats(non liberals) support this also. The reason it's being kept quiet, congress also has elections this year

[Scrub]

Bah! Accidently deleted my last post. .

But anyways, AWS, Boofo is ex-military and I belive he has experinced it if I am not mistaken. So, I think he know's what he is talking about.

[13th_Disciple]

BTW.. Canada now has a treaty with the US and will send back folks avoiding the draft and seeking refuge in Canada.. I think that was one of the points either in NAFTA or some arrangement previous to that.. can't remember.. I do know that they will send you back.. Claiming asylum won't help, nor will claiming political refugee status as we are not considered a country in turmoil.. or something along those lines..

Personally, I lived in Canada for awhile back in '99.. and while I found it nice, it didn't feel right.. Nor did I feel welcome.. I was actually very surprised to see the amount of outright hatred towards Americans in Canada..

So often, people tend to forget that the people of a country may not stand beside or even behind the reasoning of their goverment.. People of other locations use a given countries foreign policy as an immediate way to hate those from that country.. I love America.. the good ol' USA and all that.. But if I had to choose anywhere in the world, it would have to be Sweden.. They are, as far as I know, one of the last remaining large, non third world countries, to remain nuetral.. If not the only remaining country that's not considered third world..

Besides, who can resist the Swedish Bikini Team, ffs..

[Velocd]

The better of this argument is not whether this draft should be enacted, or whether it's "cowardice" for someone not to comply with the draft, but to confront the plain concept behind an American draft.

Should the government have the right to send males into military against their will? If so, why not females?

I can't plausibly see how in a government reputable for its civil rights can still shelter a draft resolution. In fact, it seems unconstitutional. I wouldn't be surprised if sometime in my life the draft is made unconstitutional. You cannot take the liberty from anyone in this country, who justly does not deserve so, away.

The other argument is why put people against a war in the military? A military works best with volunteers and people committed to its purpose. Occupying a military with bitter and discrepant individuals will only secure more convulation and tension, then ease.

[RichieBoy67]

This sure would have been a good thread on my board...www.speakoutonline.net

[VeoMorphine]

Congress is Considering Re-enacting the Draft

I decided to post this, just because I think it is a very important issue that will in fact change the way we live our lives.
The United States Congress is considering re-enacting the Draft. It would require all persons age's 18-27 to serve in some capacity for the armed forces. Both men and women will be required to serve. Running to Canada, o attending college will not be options. The United States also has an agreement with Canada to return people who try to dodge the draft by moving to Canada. College students will not be exempt. The Draft will start in June 2005.
You can find the article here:
http://www.congress.org/congressorg/...ua_congressorg

[13th_Disciple]

yeah.. we have been discussing it a bit.. check this link for a bit of background on what all we have discussed..

http://www.vbulletin.org/forum/showthread.php?t=65462

[StarBuG]

Originally Posted by 13th_Disciple

yeah.. we have been discussing it a bit.. check this link for a bit of background on what all we have discussed..

http://www.vbulletin.org/forum/showthread.php?t=65462

Germany is going to reduce or even drop the draft in the near future hehe

We finaly will be free

StarBuG

[Rose]

*draft threads merged together*