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Old 11 May 2008, 14:30
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BrandiDup BrandiDup is offline
 
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Moving from one server to two?

I'm wondering if you can tell me about your experience with moving from one dedicated server to two. How big was your site when you made the move (how many concurrent users, how many total posts, etc)? What prompted you to move, were you encountering database or server issues (Slowness, timing out, etc)?

How do you have your site setup now that you have two servers instead of one?

I've basically been told by Liquidweb, as well as a someone else who specializes more in vbulletin and server optimization that I really should consider getting a second server. We've been having issues with slow load times and "server time out" errors, despite having our current server optimized as much as possible.

How do you suggest splitting up the site between two servers, to relieve the pressure on one server? We don't have a lot of images so I don't think we would need one server just for image/attachments, we just have very active posters who love to do searches and keep things very busy.

Just looking for a little advice since this is all very new to me.
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Old 11 May 2008, 14:46
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If you move to two servers, I'd suggest having a dedicated MySQL node, and a web node. It's the logical way to split tasks anyway.
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Old 11 May 2008, 14:46
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Originally Posted by BrandiDup View Post
I'm wondering if you can tell me about your experience with moving from one dedicated server to two. How big was your site when you made the move (how many concurrent users, how many total posts, etc)? What prompted you to move, were you encountering database or server issues (Slowness, timing out, etc)?

How do you have your site setup now that you have two servers instead of one?

I've basically been told by Liquidweb, as well as a someone else who specializes more in vbulletin and server optimization that I really should consider getting a second server. We've been having issues with slow load times and "server time out" errors, despite having our current server optimized as much as possible.

How do you suggest splitting up the site between two servers, to relieve the pressure on one server? We don't have a lot of images so I don't think we would need one server just for image/attachments, we just have very active posters who love to do searches and keep things very busy.

Just looking for a little advice since this is all very new to me.
I can't speak for others, but what I have for one of my setups is a 2 server setup (a Web Server and a Database Server). Having the DB on its own server makes a HUGE difference.

I'd talk to Snakes, he seems to have his "stuff" together when it comes to server optimization and setup.
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Old 11 May 2008, 15:01
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BrandiDup BrandiDup is offline
 
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Originally Posted by bobster65 View Post
I can't speak for others, but what I have for one of my setups is a 2 server setup (a Web Server and a Database Server). Having the DB on its own server makes a HUGE difference.

I'd talk to Snakes, he seems to have his "stuff" together when it comes to server optimization and setup.
I think he's actually the one who has been helping me! I can't remember his exact username on here but it's snakes something and he's been an AMAZING wealth of information who has gone out of his way to do everything possible for my server. He pretty much agrees with liquidweb as far as me needing to make an upgrade sometime soon though.

This is definitely one of the most difficult things, financially, but it's one of those necessary evils, I guess. Without a server that functions properly, I obviously lose a significant amount of traffic, which I've already noticed.

I run two sites, the military one is definitely the biggest and busiest of the two, but my other one is steadily growing and seeing more activity by the day. They are both 100% database driven though, I have vba for both and vbulletin running for both. So, I'm unsure of how I could split the load up to make it most even. I don't have much on either site that isn't database driven, so I'm wondering if I would actually need to split the databases up somehow.

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Old 11 May 2008, 15:44
davide101 davide101 is offline
 
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BrandiDup, what are the specs on the server that you're abandoning? We are quickly growing into our quadcore server with 2gig of RAM and I'm trying to predict what the upgrade cycle might look like. At what point is it less cost-effective to get a powerful single server and two moderate servers make more sense?
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Old 11 May 2008, 15:58
snakes1100 snakes1100 is offline
 
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There are a lot of variables in moving to a two server setup and what you have now may just need to be tweaked to live a bit longer as a single server setup, a RAM upgrade is cheaper that getting another server regardless, but again, the server your on may have a RAM limitation at the mobo level as well.

Splitting the servers is easy in that aspect, its just a matter of copying data, tweaking mysql (typically a 4 day task), setting up the nic's, changing config.php and away you go.

@brandi, ill give you a hint, it has 1100 on the end....
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Old 11 May 2008, 16:01
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BrandiDup BrandiDup is offline
 
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Originally Posted by davide101 View Post
BrandiDup, what are the specs on the server that you're abandoning? We are quickly growing into our quadcore server with 2gig of RAM and I'm trying to predict what the upgrade cycle might look like. At what point is it less cost-effective to get a powerful single server and two moderate servers make more sense?
Our current server specs are

AMD Athlon X2 Dual Core 5000+
OS: Linux - CentOS 4
Memory: 4GB DDR2 SDRAM
Hd1: 160GB 7200RPM SATA / 8MB Cache
Hd2: 160GB 7200RPM SATA / 8MB Cache

We're looking at probably just adding a second one like this. I need to do a bit more research before making a final decision. I'm somewhat server stupid.

--------------- Added 11 May 2008 at 16:03 ---------------

Originally Posted by snakes1100 View Post
There are a lot of variables in moving to a two server setup and what you have now may just need to be tweaked to live a bit longer as a single server setup, a RAM upgrade is cheaper that getting another server regardless, but again, the server your on may have a RAM limitation at the mobo level as well.

Splitting the servers is easy in that aspect, its just a matter of copying data, tweaking mysql (typically a 4 day task), setting up the nic's, changing config.php and away you go.

@brandi, ill give you a hint, it has 1100 on the end....
There you are! I was thinking you were 1001. Yeah, I need to pester you again when ever you get a chance. I need to be advised by the wise one, as to what I should do. This is definitely not my forte! Heh...
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Last edited by BrandiDup : 11 May 2008 at 16:03. Reason: Auto-Merged DoublePost
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Old 11 May 2008, 17:03
royo royo is offline
 
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Alternatively, you can stick with one server and just get faster hardware.
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Old 11 May 2008, 22:26
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wmlvb wmlvb is offline
 
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BrandiCup
Sorry to hijack your thread, but I looked at your military forum and it is very similar to a military forum I will be creating. I will not compete w/ you as it is for a different geographic group of military. Is there way I can contact you and ask you some questions about your style (i like the look)? Also I would like to know how you have handled security issues related to military families! I think you can pm me w/ you contact info. I will check my settings.! Thanks
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Old 12 May 2008, 10:15
Marco van Herwaarden Marco van Herwaarden is offline
 
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AMD Athlon X2 Dual Core 5000+

This is the start of your problems. An Athlon is a processor designed for desktop computers, not for servers. Unfortunatly there are a lot of hosting companies that offer this processor for (cheap) servers.

The 2nd bottleneck might be your disks. SCSI disks in a good RAID configuration will outperform the single (assuming you have just 2 single SATA disks) disk.

I really doubt if the memory (RAM) is the bottleneck.
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Old 12 May 2008, 11:52
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BrandiDup BrandiDup is offline
 
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Originally Posted by Marco van Herwaarden View Post
AMD Athlon X2 Dual Core 5000+

This is the start of your problems. An Athlon is a processor designed for desktop computers, not for servers. Unfortunatly there are a lot of hosting companies that offer this processor for (cheap) servers.

The 2nd bottleneck might be your disks. SCSI disks in a good RAID configuration will outperform the single (assuming you have just 2 single SATA disks) disk.

I really doubt if the memory (RAM) is the bottleneck.
Oh wow, that is really interesting. Do you think any of these would be a better alternative?

Pentium 4 3GHZ Hyperthreaded
Intel E4500 DUAL CORE
Intel Q6600 QUAD CORE

Or do you have any specific suggestions for what type of processors I could look at?

This was the first dedicated server I had ever been on, so I didn't have a great idea of what to look for when I signed up for the original plan.

Thank you for your help!
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Old 12 May 2008, 12:23
Marco van Herwaarden Marco van Herwaarden is offline
 
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I don't have any specific suggestions regarding the processor, other then to get a processor designed for servers. (check the manufactor website).

Also post in Server Configuration might get you some valuable information (George/Eva2000 knows his processors )
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Old 12 May 2008, 13:02
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Dismounted Dismounted is offline
 
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Originally Posted by BrandiDup View Post
Oh wow, that is really interesting. Do you think any of these would be a better alternative?

Pentium 4 3GHZ Hyperthreaded
Intel E4500 DUAL CORE
Intel Q6600 QUAD CORE

Or do you have any specific suggestions for what type of processors I could look at?

This was the first dedicated server I had ever been on, so I didn't have a great idea of what to look for when I signed up for the original plan.

Thank you for your help!
Q6600 > E4500 > P4

Technically, they are all desktop processors, but the Xeon ("server") equivalents (X3220/Q6600) are practically the same. The only real difference is that the Xeon processor is usually binned higher, and have been more rigorously tested. Also, the Xeon processor equivalents' pin contacts have a few extra layers, not that it matters.

For a "real" server chip, you will need to find an Xeon processor not in the 3-series, which uses LGA771 (Socket J) instead of the "desktop" LGA775 (Socket T).
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Old 12 May 2008, 14:39
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BrandiDup BrandiDup is offline
 
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Originally Posted by Dismounted View Post
Q6600 > E4500 > P4

Technically, they are all desktop processors, but the Xeon ("server") equivalents (X3220/Q6600) are practically the same. The only real difference is that the Xeon processor is usually binned higher, and have been more rigorously tested. Also, the Xeon processor equivalents' pin contacts have a few extra layers, not that it matters.

For a "real" server chip, you will need to find an Xeon processor not in the 3-series, which uses LGA771 (Socket J) instead of the "desktop" LGA775 (Socket T).
Good info, thank you.

What do you think of something like this?

Processor
Dual Xeon 2.8GHZ Hyperthreaded


Options:


Memory
4GB DDR Registered/ECC
6GB DDR Registered/ECC
8GB DDR Registered/ECC

Primary Hard Drive
160GB 7200RPM SATA / 8MB Cache

Primary Hard Drive Upgrade:
Dual 160GB SATA / Hardware Raid 1
Primary Hard Drive Upgrade:
73GB 10,000RPM SCSI / 8MB Cache
Primary Hard Drive Upgrade:
Upgrade to 15,000 RPM
Serial Attached SCSI (SAS) 15,000 RPM
Dual 73GB SCSI / Hardware Raid 1
Primary Hard Drive Upgrade:
Upgrade to 15,000 RPM
Serial Attached SCSI (SAS) 15,000 RPM
3 x 120GB SATA / Hardware Raid 5
Primary Hard Drive Upgrade:
4 x 120GB SATA / Hardware Raid 5
Primary Hard Drive Upgrade:
4 x 120GB SATA / Hardware Raid 10
Primary Hard Drive Upgrade:
3 x 73GB SCSI / Hardware Raid 5
Primary Hard Drive Upgrade:
Upgrade to 15,000 RPM
Serial Attached SCSI (SAS) 15,000 RPM
4 x 73GB SCSI / Hardware Raid 5
Primary Hard Drive Upgrade:
Upgrade to 15,000 RPM
Serial Attached SCSI (SAS) 15,000 RPM
4 x 73GB SCSI / Hardware Raid 10
Primary Hard Drive Upgrade:
Upgrade to 15,000 RPM
Serial Attached SCSI (SAS) 15,000 RPM

Secondary Hard Drive
160GB 7200RPM SATA / 8MB Cache

Secondary Hard Drive Upgrade:
73GB 10,000RPM SCSI / 8MB Cache
Secondary Hard Drive Upgrade:
Upgrade to 15,000 RPM
Serial Attached SCSI (SAS) 15,000 RPM
No Backup Drive



Operating System
Linux - CentOS 4
Windows 2003 Server



Bandwidth
4000GB Monthly Transfer (2000 in + 2000 out)

Gigabit Uplink Port
10 Mbit/s Unmetered Port
Unmetered Port Speed Upgrade:




What upgrades would you make to the package? Would something like that be as good as getting 2 of my current servers? Better Worse?

I think that I definitely do need to upgrade soon, as I'm about to start a somewhat large promotional campaign for one of my sites, and I am not comfortable with doing so with my current setup that is already crapping out on me.

Edited out the links after reading the announcement. Sorry guys. I didn't mean for it to turn into hosting talk. I'm just trying to figure out what's going to be the best setup for me before I stupidly choose something that is not going to be worth my time or money.
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Last edited by BrandiDup : 12 May 2008 at 18:03.
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  #15  
Old 13 May 2008, 08:07
Marco van Herwaarden Marco van Herwaarden is offline
 
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No more memory then 4GB will probably be needed. Depending on your storage requirements (and budget), i would suggest to look at a SCSI/SAS RAID configuration for your data. 1 additional (cheap, IDE/SATA) larger disk for backup.
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