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Gio~Logist
20 Nov 2008, 00:41
I've seen quite a few members on here have unsuccessful paid requests in the Request for Paid Services (http://www.vbulletin.org/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=30) section. Hopefully this helps you all :up:

For starters, here's an article on how to successfully gather those ideas you have for development. This includes things you should consider, a bit of insight into vbulletin terms and product, and more.
Gathering ideas for development (http://www.giologist.com/vb/showthread.php?t=22)

Making A Paid Request

Be specific, know what you want
I also stressed this a lot in the article on "Gathering ideas for development". As a webmaster, it is always important to know what you want. The more familiar you are with exactly where you're going with a certain project or website, the more familiar you can make the people who are helping to make it happen. If you are confused or vague when making a request, chances are that the people who can actually help you will be just as confused

Posting A Paid Request

Always include a detailed outline for any request you make. The more detail you include, the less chances there are for error.
The documentation on your project can make or break the success of it. Consider this like the "Business Plan" of your project. Create documentation similar to how this article is formatted (headings, listings, etc.)
Cover every aspect of your project.
If multiple sections are required, be sure to outline the requirements for these sections and the functions needed.
If there are functions needed both for the end-user, and on the administrative side of your website, be sure to include that as well.
Include mockups if applicable.
A mockup doesn't have to be anything more than an image (made on paint or photoshop or any other image-editing software) showing more or less what you're looking for.
Include links if applicable.
If there are any existing websites that have something more or less like what you're looking for, include the url in the request. Include the things you do like as well as what you do don't. Hiring For A Paid Request

Do your homework on the developer
Do they have a website for their services? If so, check it out. How credible does it look? Have you heard of this website before? Do they appear to have a broad (and satisfied) customer-range?
Ask for references. If you do not know who this developer is or haven't seen any references for this person, don't hesitate to ask. Any successful developer should have the resources needed in order to make you feel as safe as possible.
Are they contacting you via a forum? If so, check their profile on that forum. See the posts they've made, check out the relationships they have with certain users or comments users have made about them. This will help you have a better understanding of who this person is.
Know the value of the project
You can check out "Gathering ideas for development" for a bit more on this. However, it is always important to know the value of your project.
Is the developer charging too much or too little? Don't hesitate to ask for more quotes.
"You get what you pay for". This is true online as well. Just because someone offers to work for cheap, does not mean that their work will be Quality. As a matter of fact, expect to pay more for Quality work.
Are you willing to allow the developer to resell any work they make for you? Some developers sell their products and services to several people. If your idea is a popular one, the developer may be willing to do the work for less and sell it to more.
What kind of rates are you being offered?
Is the developer charging you based on a fixed rate or an hourly/weekly rate? Finalizing a paid request
So you've posted your request and you've found a developer to take on the project. Now, lets get to business.
Communication, communication, communication
Be sure to keep in contact with your developer as needed. Ask them what means of communication they offer. Do they deal with instant messaging clients when talking to customers? Do they keep in contact via email? If so, how often are they available to respond?
The more communication is made, the more likely you are to have a satisfying final result.
Request updates
Request updates along the way. You can begin by asking exactly when an update will be made available. Whether they're sending you screenshots via email or live demos, it is always important to keep up-to-date with the work you are requesting.
Will the developer be working directly on your website? If so, then you get the flexibility of course of "live updates". Be sure to ask them if any errors will turn up along the way as a result of working directly on your website.
Ask for suggestions, solve a problem before it becomes "too much"
As a developer, this person has probably dealt with more websites than you have. For this reason, they should be highly qualified to make suggestions to your projects. This can be towards your benefit, to feel free to ask. If not them, ask members on your website if they have any ideas to add-on.
See something that can be a potential problem? Point it out! It's always better to deal with potential problems in a project the second they come about, as oppose to waiting towards the end.
Keep contact information on this developer, or any documentation related towards it. This will help you to later make improvements or changes. If you decide to hire the same developer, you'll have their contact info saved. If that's not possible, you'll at least have a product and documentation to show a new developer.Now, request away! May all of your vbulletin dreams come true ;)

lasto
20 Nov 2008, 00:49
Its all very well having this but why not go all the way and make one called :

Guide to a UnSuccessful Paid Request and how the board is here to help you.

But you cant because the simple reason is - if you get ripped off besides posting the person name in the actual paid request thread there is nothing you can do about it.You are basically on your own and any whinging on the board will incur some form of threat such as an infaction or possibly a ban.

Even with the Guide above its Inevitable that things will go wrong but yet u have failed to explain to anyone what they can do if they have been scammed.

Gio~Logist
20 Nov 2008, 00:53
Thanks. As for getting "ripped off", that's covered in the following area:
Do your homework on the developer

If you have done your homework right, there is absolutely no reason as to why you've still ended up with a "scam artist" as a developer. Unless they are just that good at scamming.

As for what to do after... The best thing I can tell you is to learn from your mistakes, and do things right the second time around. You can also file a complaint and use as much detail as possible. Or find others that have had bad experiences with this person and tell them to assist you in nailing them down.

Paypal can't help too much with intangible goods. This is why it's mostly up to you to avoid these kinds of situations. This is a problem that is found world-wide and all across the internet. It's up to you to avoid it.

lasto
20 Nov 2008, 00:58
What im trying to say even if you do your research you can still be scammed but you seem to be missing that point and actually ignoring the point of what made u do this thread in the 1st place
I brought some goods off you not long ago from your site - how would you feel once i got the goods i reversed the charge in paypal by saying invalid transaction - would`nt feel to good would you.
Well thats the same feeling you get when someone scams you,and you writing a guide and then saying do your homework does`nt solve one little thing.

SEOvB
20 Nov 2008, 01:10
Thanks. As for getting "ripped off", that's covered in the following area:
Do your homework on the developer

If you have done your homework right, there is absolutely no reason as to why you've still ended up with a "scam artist" as a developer. Unless they are just that good at scamming.



It seems lately, that even the ones with previous good feedback are now getting negative feedback left. Which makes it even more difficult to trust someone from here, because no one wants to be that first guy to get ripped off.



As for what to do after... The best thing I can tell you is to learn from your mistakes, and do things right the second time around. You can also file a complaint and use as much detail as possible. Or find others that have had bad experiences with this person and tell them to assist you in nailing them down.

Paypal can't help too much with intangible goods. This is why it's mostly up to you to avoid these kinds of situations. This is a problem that is found world-wide and all across the internet. It's up to you to avoid it.

Always put in your request that you want the files on some form of tangible goods IE a cd, disk, jump drive, whatever you want. That way paypal will still have a chance to protect you, or shut the scammers account down.

Alternatively using a Escrow service is always a viable option if you don't fully trust who you're giving money to.

Gio~Logist
20 Nov 2008, 01:27
What im trying to say even if you do your research you can still be scammed but you seem to be missing that point and actually ignoring the point of what made u do this thread in the 1st place
I brought some goods off you not long ago from your site - how would you feel once i got the goods i reversed the charge in paypal by saying invalid transaction - would`nt feel to good would you.
Well thats the same feeling you get when someone scams you,and you writing a guide and then saying do your homework does`nt solve one little thing.

Lasto, I'm sorry for your recent experiences with your service requests. Honestly, I am. But you're taking your frustration out in the wrong place. This thread wasn't made in order to end all possible scamming, that's impossible. I made this to help you all with the overall experience and guide you to what can hopefully be a positive one.

What advice can I offer you on not getting scammed? Other than doing your homework, not much. Things happen. Not everyone in this world has good intentions and that's inevitably a fact of life. Hopefully with the few tips provided it can happen to less people, but it will always happen.

I'm happy to have you as a customer, and glad you like the product(s) I have to offer. If there's anything I can ever do for you, don't hesitate to drop a message. If you need a project done and I can't do it, I'll try my best to find someone who can. Good luck, and I hope your recent bad experiences are followed by nothing but success!

--------------- Added 1227144596 at 1227144596 ---------------

It seems lately, that even the ones with previous good feedback are now getting negative feedback left. Which makes it even more difficult to trust someone from here, because no one wants to be that first guy to get ripped off.



Always put in your request that you want the files on some form of tangible goods IE a cd, disk, jump drive, whatever you want. That way paypal will still have a chance to protect you, or shut the scammers account down.

Alternatively using a Escrow service is always a viable option if you don't fully trust who you're giving money to.

That's a good point. It's hard to tell who to trust at times. But I mean, what can honestly be a valid reason towards going back and changing your feedback on a certain project? Either the developer converted to a scammer, or maybe just stopped developing? I agree though, it isn't so much a good thing when old-time trustworthy developers disappear or begin to resort to "scamming".

lasto
20 Nov 2008, 10:14
Lasto, I'm sorry for your recent experiences with your service requests. Honestly, I am. But you're taking your frustration out in the wrong place. This thread wasn't made in order to end all possible scamming, that's impossible. I made this to help you all with the overall experience and guide you to what can hopefully be a positive
accept my apology m8 if i seemed to be taking my frustration out on you.

Paul M
20 Nov 2008, 12:18
Off topic posts and the usual staff digs removed. If this cannot remain civil and on topic then it will get closed.

Princeton
20 Nov 2008, 13:17
moved to vBulletin Articles (http://www.vbulletin.org/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=187)

Brandon Sheley
21 Dec 2008, 06:03
Don't forget if and when you have work done by someone you have hired, to check up on the work after they are finished.
I've seen a number of recent affiliate links hidden without the client knowing about them :eek: usually in the footer or as an hosted image.
Just do your research, but also look over the work and make sure it's exactly what is agreed upon ;)

ps.. Great article Gio~ :) 5 stars

Taragon
21 Dec 2008, 18:40
Thank you, itís a great article.

Personally I also try to list my past (successful) request within my new request.
This way a developer will be ensured I do know the meaning of money.

Spend some time to properly close your request. Name the developer, and rate his entry in your original request.
This way other people can learn from your experience with this coder/designer.
Also, donít forget to thank the developers who have replied, but havenít received the assignment.

As already mentioned in the article, communication is a must.
Make sure youíll always have access to past communications. Donít sign up to a third party website. Or make copies of your writings when you do.
When communicating by MSN Messenger or alike make sure it 'll create a proper backup of the things spoken of.