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  #1  
Old 30 Oct 2013, 16:31
katie hunter's Avatar
katie hunter katie hunter is offline
 
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Well, this is not fair Xenforo Vs IB and we are in the middle.

I have been thinking about all the past drama and now i see that both Xenforo and IB were at fault and it is not fair. Well they say life isn't fair.

But to begin with, the old VB staff like Kier and Mike left and were trying to built something like Vbulletin. The one thing that isn't fair is that they have followers and when they left, all the followers followed them, after all, they have been with vb for years, that was a leverage and a smart move.

While IB was really stupid to begin a lawsuit, but really there was no choice, i do understand their stance as well. But they are terrible in term of pleasing customers and listening to what they propose, that is their down fall. They bought Vbulletin for business and should also think about its community aspect, that is part of a successful business too. It is not just about "Lets get the job done, and see the number of $$ rising" - this aggressive business approach, doesn't always succeed.

The one thing which bugs me the most, are all the good developers. They left and code on Xenforo. Xenforo isn't complete and lacks so many default features which VB has. VB did not end with VB 5.x, but there is a good VB 3.x and 4.x and 4.x is amazing, it needs more support though, it should actually be the focus as much as vb 5.x because that is what many use.

No matter how much i compare and contrast Xenforo vs VBulletin 4.x, the difference is huge in term of functions and VB wins in that part.

But those who decided to code for Xenforo ex should also code for VBulletin i.e., 4.x. They are taking a stance where they say, ok we will only support Xenforo. But they are being selfish here, why not support both. At the end of the day, the ones who are harmed are all the customers who bought vb, because they always look to improve it with addons and plugins.

It is borderline disrespectful and for us to chose between two products, well I will buy Xenforo 3 years from now when it is complete but not now. It lacks so many features and to try to convince myself to buy all these addons from Xenforo which tries to make up for the missing Xenforo features, honestly you will be spending more like $600+ Xenforo + addons/plugins just to meet of somewhat level of the default features vbulletin 4.x has.
  #2  
Old 30 Oct 2013, 19:36
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cellarius cellarius is offline
 
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Real name: Sven
You realize that people are free to code for whatever software they choose, and you have no right to addons those coders make, whatsoever? Most addons here are/were completely free, made by volunteers in their spare time, coding for the software they themselves used.

Simple solution: If you need addons, you pay someone to code them for you. Calling people "selfish" or "borderline disrespectful" just because they do not continue to code for a software they no longer use (and, of course, they should do that for free, am I right?) is just, well, disrepectful and, well, selfish, and, hm, barefaced.
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Please note that there will be no further updates to my addons, especially they will not be upgraded for vB5. I'm leaving vB, since IB choose to go the banana-way yet again.

http://www.roma-antiqua.de
  #3  
Old 30 Oct 2013, 19:39
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Zachery Zachery is offline
 
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When you pay someone for their time, you are allowed to make reasonable expectations for their services.

If you do not pay someone for their times, you have no right to dictate to them how they spend their time
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  #4  
Old 30 Oct 2013, 19:53
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katie hunter katie hunter is offline
 
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Originally Posted by cellarius View Post
You realize that people are free to code for whatever software they choose, and you have no right to addons those coders make, whatsoever? Most addons here are/were completely free, made by volunteers in their spare time, coding for the software they themselves used.

Simple solution: If you need addons, you pay someone to code them for you. Calling people "selfish" or "borderline disrespectful" just because they do not continue to code for a software they no longer use (and, of course, they should do that for free, am I right?) is just, well, disrepectful and, well, selfish, and, hm, barefaced.
I never said free in my thread, in fact the example i pointed out, the coder is selling his gallery for 40 USD on Xenforo. It is selfish when many of these coders do sell their plugin and code it only for Xenforo, they can do the same on VB and sell it and offer pro vs lite.

But then they are taking sides because of this whole drama Xenforo vs IB and we are in the middle.

They are being selfish because they have took a stance to support only Xenforo and have left, disregarded all the happy customers/ members from vb who made them popular and noticeable in the first place, through plugin votes, plugin of the month and so on.

Please note that there will be no further updates to my addons, especially they will not be upgraded for vB5. I'm leaving vB, since IB choose to go the banana-way yet again.

http://www.roma-antiqua.de
Think about it ^ your signature.

Last edited by katie hunter; 30 Oct 2013 at 20:06.
  #5  
Old 30 Oct 2013, 19:54
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Max Taxable Max Taxable is offline
 
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*facepalm*

By the same token, they might say YOU are being "selfish" by staying with vBulletin.
  #6  
Old 30 Oct 2013, 20:00
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katie hunter katie hunter is offline
 
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That is what happen, i like Xenforo but i can't buy it now at this stage and all i get when i went there, well the users are friendly and helpful, that is an A+ and the staff too and that is where IB and VB are making the mistake.

IB and VB should enhance VB 4.x and add more and better features, and the sales will be going up for sure. VB 5.x will need at least around 2 years of development to reach the stable level and having all the default features of vb 4.x, that is my take on it.

But then again, i am not into joining bandwagons and although i was asked by several to make a migration to Xenforo form VB, it just wouldn't work well for me. There so many default vb features that Xenforo don't have at all.

I am simply going to use what is good, and feature rich and Vbulletin is reach in features more then Xenforo. What i don't like is the coders who joined the bandwagon and followed Xenforo, have discontinued making plugins for VB and not even selling them. It is like they have taken a moral stance but have they also thought about vb customers who are welling to buy their plugin for vb and now they miss it?

What they are doing, isn't going to force many vb customers to make the switch to Xenforo, just for the sake of downloading their plugin or buying them. They should really release them for both Xenforo and Vbulletin and if they sell them on Xenforo, why not sell them on Vbulletin as well. After all, that is where they received their fame, from vb customers.

Last edited by katie hunter; 30 Oct 2013 at 20:05.
  #7  
Old 30 Oct 2013, 20:42
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borbole borbole is offline
 
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Originally Posted by katie hunter View Post


But those who decided to code for Xenforo ex should also code for VBulletin i.e., 4.x. They are taking a stance where they say, ok we will only support Xenforo. But they are being selfish here, why not support both. At the end of the day, the ones who are harmed are all the customers who bought vb, because they always look to improve it with addons and plugins.
This is way beyond strange and weird. So people should code for vb just so you can use free stuff, i.e. get what you want and they are selfish when they don''t do it? Are you for real? In what world do you live in? Unbelievable, I have seen some strange, weird and selfish users all rolled up in one but boy, you do take the cake
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  #8  
Old 30 Oct 2013, 20:46
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katie hunter katie hunter is offline
 
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I think you guys don't even read read what i said above ^ I do need my Halloween cake though

They can code it and sell it for VB as well http://xenmediagallery.com/buy/xen-media-gallery.1/ I didn't say anything about FREE!
  #9  
Old 30 Oct 2013, 20:51
skol skol is offline
 
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Originally Posted by borbole View Post
This is way beyond strange and weird. So people should code for vb just so you can use free stuff, i.e. get what you want and they are selfish when they don''t do it? Are you for real? In what world do you live in? Unbelievable, I have seen some strange, weird and selfish users all rolled up in one but boy, you do take the cake
But the post has something right,unfortunately you can't see it.

the ones who are harmed are all the customers.
You can't separate customers.They are one and pay all the bills in anything.Whether you agree or not with them,you are certainly nothing without them.
  #10  
Old 30 Oct 2013, 21:05
nhawk nhawk is offline
 
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I code for both vB and XF. And I can give you two very good reasons why many coders don't code for vB anymore...

They do not have the ability to post/advertise their premium add-ons anywhere on the vB sites. And they are forced to release LITE versions to have the ability to TRY to sell the premium versions.

From my personal experience, my XF sales versus vB sales are running about 25:1.

So, what do you think most coders are going to do? Where do you think they are going to focus their attention?

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure that one out.

Now, should I code a LITE add-on with 4000 lines of code AND a PREMIUM add-on with 6000 lines of code for vB? Or, do I just go straight to a single 6000 line premium add-on for the other software? Again, not hard to choose.

Last edited by nhawk; 30 Oct 2013 at 21:25.
  #11  
Old 30 Oct 2013, 21:33
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katie hunter katie hunter is offline
 
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Originally Posted by nhawk View Post
I code for both vB and XF. And I can give you two very good reasons why many coders don't code for vB anymore...

They do not have the ability to post/advertise their premium add-ons anywhere on the vB sites. And they are forced to release LITE versions to have the ability to TRY to sell the premium versions.

From my personal experience, my XF sales versus vB sales are running about 25:1.

So, what do you think most coders are going to do? Where do you think they are going to focus their attention?

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure that one out.

Now, should I code a LITE add-on with 4000 lines of code AND a PREMIUM add-on with 6000 lines of code for vB? Or, do I just go straight to a single 6000 line premium add-on for the other software? Again, not hard to choose.
If you have a suggestion like this, why not raise it to VB.org staff for them to add a system like Xenforo with payment for plugins.

Xenforo just took advantage of a feature like this because they know many coders will love it. It is a smart move.
  #12  
Old 30 Oct 2013, 21:43
nhawk nhawk is offline
 
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Originally Posted by katie hunter View Post
If you have a suggestion like this, why not raise it to VB.org staff for them to add a system like Xenforo with payment for plugins.

Xenforo just took advantage of a feature like this because they know many coders will love it. It is a smart move.
I do believe it's been discussed many times here on vB.org. But somehow, lite versions of products are always included in those discussions.
  #13  
Old 30 Oct 2013, 21:52
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Zachery Zachery is offline
 
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Real name: Zachery Woods
No one forces anyone to release "lite" plugins.
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  #14  
Old 30 Oct 2013, 22:24
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borbole borbole is offline
 
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Originally Posted by katie hunter View Post
If you have a suggestion like this, why not raise it to VB.org staff for them to add a system like Xenforo with payment for plugins.

Xenforo just took advantage of a feature like this because they know many coders will love it. It is a smart move.
Couldn''t agree more with you on this one. It is indeed a very smart move. Unfortunately vb wants to eat everything itself, metaphorically speaking of course. They say something along the lines of we don''t want our customers to pay for mods. Because like that vb becomes more appealing to the current and potential customers.

And they are right. I have seen ex vb-ers when they convert to Ipb or xenforo complain and moan when they see paid add ons and say, why we have to pay for this add on when in vb was for free etc etc.

That is nice for vb but for me not so. I can''t speak for other coders, but why should I waste my time coding mods here so others can download them for free and sing praise to vb how good they are for having free mods etc etc. When I can sell my work elsewhere and make some very much needed money in these hard economic times?

Not to mention the other points put so well above by nhawk.
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  #15  
Old 30 Oct 2013, 22:42
nhawk nhawk is offline
 
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Originally Posted by Zachery View Post
No one forces anyone to release "lite" plugins.
Not in the literal sense, but if a coder wants to get some type of promotion/exposure of their premium products here on vB.org, they must release a lite version of that product to include a link to the premium product in the lite product's description.

Last edited by nhawk; 30 Oct 2013 at 22:48.
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