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  #16  
Old 10 Oct 2009, 06:45
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Originally Posted by Dean C View Post
Might as well add version control while you're at it I don't think this place will ever become that though. Its hard enough getting any change implemented here as it is
And then everyone will have a massive debate over which system we should implement...
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  #17  
Old 11 Oct 2009, 16:46
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Originally Posted by Dean C View Post
Might as well add version control while you're at it I don't think this place will ever become that though. Its hard enough getting any change implemented here as it is
The solution would be to post in a more postive way then dean. I won't pretend and like this idea because this would give the original author no rights on his/her work if things turn out sour. Sure, on paper it sounds like a great idea but this to me only benefits vbulletin.org and would restrict the author to remove his/her work if he/she allows a third party to join/takeover a project, script that they where brought in to get involved in. If coders want to recruit other people I guess they could realistically do this on their own site retaining full rights to their work.


How would that exactly work out? If the original author (let's say) had an argument with the staff and/or person they brought in and wished for the work to be removed but the person who was brought in rejected this and wanted it kept on the site?

These are the questions that really need to be asked before such an implementation is enforced.
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  #18  
Old 12 Oct 2009, 18:38
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Quite simply if you don't like the idea than don't participate. The suggestion was meant to augment the current offerings not replace them. If you don't want someone taking over the project than don't invite anyone to be on your team.

However if you're interested in a more open development environment and willing to create an open project the capabilities should be available here instead of elsewhere.
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  #19  
Old 12 Oct 2009, 19:16
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I like the idea... doesn't seem too realistic here though. I don't see why people don't just use sourceforge or github for collaboration and then put the final release here. Surely only supporting authors would need to do is edit the release itself -- the primary author can simply update the package.
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  #20  
Old 12 Oct 2009, 19:58
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git is the "new thing" apparently ..
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  #21  
Old 12 Oct 2009, 22:51
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Originally Posted by Wayne Luke View Post
Quite simply if you don't like the idea than don't participate. The suggestion was meant to augment the current offerings not replace them. If you don't want someone taking over the project than don't invite anyone to be on your team.

However if you're interested in a more open development environment and willing to create an open project the capabilities should be available here instead of elsewhere.
So let me get this straight, I'm not allowed to participate and express my opinion if it disagrees with you? Last time I checked Wayne this forum is a public one, and anyone can contribute to discussions.

My point stands, change has generally not been embraced here partly due to what I feel has been a misdirected administration, but mainly because of lack of resources.

I think the best thing that could happen is to allow the community to work together on improving the vB.org platform. Have some coders put their money where their mouth is and do the development It's easy for people like you and I to make these suggestions but it's the administration (who have day jobs, and some families) who have to put in the work.
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  #22  
Old 12 Oct 2009, 23:06
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My same arguments still stand .. http://www.vbulletin.org/forum/showthread.php?t=225025 (last few posts where dean basically says the same)

Plus, all that wayne is saying is that if you have no trust in this and dont feel it's worth it, its obviously not to your interest .. so why bother posting ?
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  #23  
Old 12 Oct 2009, 23:31
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Originally Posted by Dean C View Post
So let me get this straight, I'm not allowed to participate and express my opinion if it disagrees with you? Last time I checked Wayne this forum is a public one, and anyone can contribute to discussions.
Dean, Wayne wasn't talking about you not participating in this discussion, he was saying that if they actually did implement this idea, that you as a coder would have the choice to either do it or just keep doing what you've always done.
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  #24  
Old 13 Oct 2009, 06:16
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Originally Posted by Floris View Post
git is the "new thing" apparently ..
Well... it's not really a fad or anything, it's just an alternative to Subversion that is a bit more intuitive and easier to use. I also seem to find GitHub much more modern and usable than SourceForge. Git is distributed, so it's actually possible to set up your own local repositories within a few minutes. Getting coders and designers into the habit of throwing their stuff into version control is very beneficial to the community!

Maybe it's just me, but there are already very good tools and services that perform these tasks... why re-invent the wheel? All vBulletin.org's role needs to be is with distributing these releases, and pointing coders in the right direction who want to help (repository location).
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  #25  
Old 13 Oct 2009, 07:18
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Originally Posted by bobster65 View Post
Dean, Wayne wasn't talking about you not participating in this discussion, he was saying that if they actually did implement this idea, that you as a coder would have the choice to either do it or just keep doing what you've always done.
Apologies then
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  #26  
Old 18 Oct 2009, 15:56
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Cool

I agree that product owners (manager) should have the means to add co-authors - to allow for updates, etc.

An issue that will come up is how will the point system be addressed for co-authors? eg. install count, status titles, etc

With that said, I believe our current system needs a major overhaul - not small tweaks. It's current form lacks extensibility and usability.
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  #27  
Old 18 Oct 2009, 16:34
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Cool

Originally Posted by Wayne Luke View Post
Quite simply if you don't like the idea than don't participate. The suggestion was meant to augment the current offerings not replace them. If you don't want someone taking over the project than don't invite anyone to be on your team.

However if you're interested in a more open development environment and willing to create an open project the capabilities should be available here instead of elsewhere.
Our goal (on vborg) is to educate and make available addons for vbulletin. Product collaboration is not one of our goals - at least it never has been. That's not to say that we will never consider some form of "product collaboration". If anything it may be considered as an additional service to what is already offered.

The problem that I see is that everyone is asking for "extra stuff" but no one has addressed the underlying problem - the existing system confuses and over-complicates.

Let's see ... we currently use the system to:
  1. Provide product information
  2. Count downloads
  3. Count Installs
  4. Post inquires
  5. Post problems
  6. Post bugs
  7. Post feedback
  8. Post "thank you"
  9. Collaborate (not a true collaboration but nevertheless it does exist in some form)
  10. Promote - as a form of promotional material
  11. etc, etc
Personally, I feel that we need to start segregating similar information. ie bugs, thank you, questions, etc In addition, we need to improve usability for both the visitor and the programmer.

Most visitors just want to download and install. They want to be assured that what they are downloading is worth the time. Good/Bad feedback regarding product will help. They could care less about the hundreds of posts left by others.

Programmers should be encouraged to release more products to the community. We need to create a system that benefits the programmer as well as the visitors. I would go as far as suggesting a system that segregates members (as Premium) who donate to the product owner. Thereby, the owner (product manager) can easily tell who has donated to product.
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  #28  
Old 19 Oct 2009, 09:18
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Originally Posted by Princeton View Post
Programmers should be encouraged to release more products to the community. We need to create a system that benefits the programmer as well as the visitors. I would go as far as suggesting a system that segregates members (as Premium) who donate to the product owner. Thereby, the owner (product manager) can easily tell who has donated to product.
The problem with premium support is that you will then be indirectly responsible (in donator's eyes) for policing any authors that don't provide enough support to those who pay. I think it's a good idea for honest people but there's a few bad apples around
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  #29  
Old 19 Oct 2009, 13:49
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Originally Posted by Dean C View Post
The problem with premium support is that you will then be indirectly responsible (in donator's eyes) for policing any authors that don't provide enough support to those who pay. I think it's a good idea for honest people but there's a few bad apples around
I'm not suggesting anything advance ... just something in addition to what we currently offer via the Paypal Donate option we have. For example, if someone donates to one of your "addons" you will be able to see this when visiting your product / replying to post etc. Only you (the product author) will be able to see this - no one else.

the idea is that you can provide better support to those who donate - of course, a smart person would never ignore the others
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